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November 06, 2009


Dave Doty

I am not familiar with Jack Cafferty or the situation room but are we placing an expectation of Christlikeness on those who are not followers of Christ? Is that a reasonable expectation?


Hey, Dave, great question. The issue here is one of basic morality. This guy made a claim that runs counter to the biblical evidence as to what God expects. Minimally, we should agree that what God expects meets the standard of being "moral." I'd be happy to take on the deeper question implied by your question in a subsequent post:)

Dave Doty

Excellent. Thanks. I am very interested in how we influence the surrounding culture that does not share the Judeo-Christian value system. Obviously we need to think these things through from both rational and emotional perspectives that carry more universal appeal.

I like the phrase "common cause" for getting Christians to come alongside justifiable issue activism, like environmentalism. What a witness to have Christians actually encouraging Greenpeace and such. Or any number of gender rights or economic justice organizations.


Hi Chuck,

Kelly Hahn here, old student of yours. I agree to a point, but it seems that the moral obligation to care for the poor was to be realized by the wealthy giving of their own desire (1 Tim. 6:18-19 for example) rather than the wealthy being taxed? And, while maybe not directly related to the health care issue, I do think it would be unfair to tax the wealthy if (and I only say "if") it fostered complacency and laziness on the part of those benefitting from the wealthy. I'm afraid that would only create a welfare society. Those are my concerns, I guess. I've been studying the Scriptures and trying to answer the question: "Who are the poor according to Scripture?" and so I've obviously been relating the question to the current debates. Anyway, hope you're well. I've still got "The Wizard" by Uriah Heep on my iPod because of you!


The Wizard? Sounds like a "song for the day" candidate :-)

Chuck, nice to see you back where you belong - blogging!

The examples you cite are from a "theocratic nation" that followed God and His Laws - well, tried to anyway. We live in a land of "separation of church and state" where we are free to believe on not believe in whatever we deem to be "god". So perhaps to Dave's point above, can we really correlate the guy's comment to scripture?

What's unfortunate is that this is a "political" issue and by definition, half the nation will agree and the other half disagree while we all seek to take the moral high ground. Is "morality" a personal decision or can/should it be legislated?


how can we concern ourselves with the laziness of those with less financial resources than wealthy individuals if wealthy individuals pay higher taxes? isn't it enough that just by virtue of the wealthy having MORE means they should pay more taxes? isn't that what a progressive tax system is? and how can we assume that one who has less money is lazy when needing assistance? so many people now have to work more than one job (at very low wages) just to struggle to make it. not get by or have enough or even get ahead....just struggle to make it! that's ok? and why would a society that states it is founded on christian principles actually allow anyone to be poor? it's a cruel society that demands everyone work and pull their own weight and then by fiat and hubris, sets up a hierarchy of what work will be rewarded for what and with how [email protected]! do we actually believe wall street types earned their billions in the last few years, if ever?? if we are going to be christians, it's not enough to say so and then allow the constructs of society to dictate how a person's worth should be judged or who is worthy and who is not.

Roger D. McKinney

"Progressive" taxation was considered immoral by all political thinkers in the US until WWI. With a flat tax, say 10% like the tither, the wealthy do pay more. They just don't pay a higher rate. A progressive tax was considered immoral because the state is supposed to treat all citizens equally. How would people feel if we taxes Jews at twice the rate as gentiles? The same principle that underlies civil rights applies to taxation.

As the US became less Christian, Christian morality became less important, especially the prohibition of envy.

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