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September 13, 2007

Comments

Bruce

This is another good example of why Edwards is my choice for President

Omar

Yeah... that's real bold and great of John Edwards and all. But these Dems are just as guilty for the war as Bush. They were, of course, the ones who voted to give Bush the power to fight this war in the first place. The Dems want to talk about the "failure of the Iraqi government"? What about their failure.

While you know I have never supported this war, the Dems only answer has more to do with their own election dreams than with what is best for Iraq. It is now more clear and obvious than ever that it does not matter if one is a Republican or a Democrat, the only real concern on both sides is the next election and what happens to American lives. And all the while, the people... let me rephase... the HUMANS MADE IN THE IMMAGE OF GOD who are mothers and fathers, sons and daughters, husbands and wives are made to suffer.

I have still not yet heard anything from the Republicans, the Deomocrats... or even Jim Wallis for that matter... that have fully addressed this issue. Everything is still about US, not them. And I think this is a sin.

Omar

Look at the story in Nehemiah... the people are living in destruction because of their sin. When Nehemiah delivers his famous prayer in chapter one, he CONFESSES this sin of his people that have led to this destruction... even though he wasn't even born before this happened.

In other words, until we confess as a people, a nation and a government that we are guilty for what has happened in Iraq, we will get no where. We are guilty for funding and supporting Saddaam even though we knew he was gassing and killing his own people. We are guilty for the first Gulf War that left Iraq in ruins with no ability to re-build. We are guilty for fighting this illegal war, and for the criminal negligance that it was fought with that did not prepare for what to do once Baghdad fell, which has lead to where we are now.

While Jim Wallis and SOJO is leading the way in calling for an end to the war, when will they step up in a full prophetic voice and declare that the candidates they are supporting are guilty, too. When will they stand up, and do as Nehemiah did, and say "WE AS A PEOPLE ARE GUILTY, EVEN IF I MYSELF WAS NOT EVEN THERE." Unitl I hear that confession, I don't hear anything really helpful coming from anyone.

DB

I agree with you, Omar. The sin is the separation from God's desires for humanity as a functional non-violent community that begins with personal commitment. The biblical stories of that little nation caught between Mediterraneanian World Powers--Israel's Old Testament stories--had the nation going the way of the king... and he did right or he did wrong in the sight of God and the king's people were guilty too. OT Prophets came and went telling of their personal visons and judgements with pleas and faith. Omar, I like Jonah sitting on the hill scratching his head at the end of his book. Then came the personal assault against the one intolerable act which saw God incarnated in Jesus of Nazareth... Israel was bowing before the Roman Emperor calling himself god as the Israeli King Herod built a Hebrew temple that was destined to be obliterated after the temple was declared in future tense to being rebuilt in the people who knew and followed Jesus the Christ... them of him. He taught what Omar is speaking about as he writes about wars, "We are guilty...." Add something about how we treat aliens in our country, churches, homes. America's ethics are guilt ridden. Our king is money and power and pleasure and entertainment. And add also that I am no prophet but just look at the future in this Associated Press release and you guess at the consequences, "A U.N. panel on climate change has predicted that polar regions could be virtually free of ice by the summer of 2070 because of rising temperatures and sea ice decline, ESA noted.

Russia, Norway, Denmark, Canada and the United States are among countries in a race to secure rights to the Arctic that heated up last month when Russia sent two small submarines to plant its national flag under the North Pole. A U.S. study has suggested as much as 25 percent of the world's undiscovered oil and gas could be hidden in the area." What's the prophecy here? peace anyway.

DB

AH! I am a wondering if God will be credited for providentially creating a global warming AND the loss of polar ice so that America can have a convienently located source of oil. Why political economists might be converted to the lord as they see the divine plan: Iraqi owned oil sold to Russia as America boosts her own reserves from the Arctic perpetuating the most glorious military economy the world has yet seen. PTL, eh?

Bruce

On a much smaller scale, John Edwards HAS said he was wrong for his vote authorizing the use of force prior to the Iraq war. That's not quite the more comprehensive confession you're talking about, but it's a start.
While we're talking about the nation confessing it's sins, let's confess that we were wrong, back in the 1950's when the CIA led a coup against the then president of Iran and installed the Shah. That happened after the Iranian gov't and BP oil company couldn't come to financial terms on sharing the profits from the development of Iran's oil industry. I'm sure the Iranians have very long memories.

John the ex-Baptist

Somewhat on-topic to this conversation, I've heard that Sally Field was censored on the Emmys last night for saying "God-damned wars". I have to say, in all seriousness, that that statement represents a deep and profound theological view that I subscribe to. I am concerned that it would be deemed unacceptable for public discussion.

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